$115 Bookshelf Speaker Measurements
This company’s horn tweeter
should be used in the orientation as it was designed, but if you were keen on
using their speakers, how would you avoid the wave interference that the
horizontally aligned MTM center channel had?
One solution is to completely avoid their center channel and use a
bookshelf speaker, hopefully one that’s identical to your left and right
speakers. With this configuration, you
get a properly oriented horn as well as a much smoother frequency response
across the room. The price is $230 for a
pair, so depending on if you can find any use for the other bookshelf or not,
you just saved yourself from $20 to $135 and got better sound to boot. Cheaper and better? Win, win, and win.
Below is the chart showing the frequency response deviation from on-axis to 40 degrees off-axis. The chart shows the same off-axis roughness of the tweeter, but there may be other reasons why you would otherwise like the speaker’s sound. Importantly to this endeavor, the midrange doesn’t show any significant change in frequency response at different angles.
The 1/6 octave chart below shows that the bookshelf speaker performs very well off-axis by only having one midrange driver. For comparison’s sake, we will focus on the same frequency range of the midrange and score the variation. The average standard deviation of the frequency with respect to angle for the bookshelf is 1.01.
So what have we figured out thus far? First, that the horizontally oriented MTM center channel has significant variation in frequency response at different angles. Second, that by vertically orienting the MTM speaker we were able to significantly reduce the variation, but this company’s horn performance suffers and otherwise compromises this plan. And third, the smoothest response and less expensive bookshelf performs better, while possibly matching your left and right channels with complete perfection.
If we compare their standard deviations at different angles, we can get an idea of the variation or roughness in the 1/6 octave frequency response. In the chart below, the three configurations are graphed with their standard deviations. Lower scores are better. Clearly, if one were shopping for a surround sound system from this company, the better performing, better value choice would be to use three identical bookshelf speakers across the front soundstage.
|
|
Average Frequency
Variation From 0-Axis, |
|
$250 MTM Horizontal Center |
1.94 |
|
$250 MTM Vertical Center |
1.19 |
|
$115 ($230) Bookshelf |
1.01 |
Recent Forum Posts:
irish;637493
Thanks for the recommendations. The Beta 360 would be too large for my application although it does look nice. The KEF Q series, iQ60c, looks like it might work pretty well as it's less than 7" tall. The speaker cabinet design is a bit different but that isn't a breaking point. How do co-axials differ from in sound or performance from a more "traditional" design where the speakers are seperate?
If more speakers had a wider bandwidth, then there would be no crossovers and multiple speakers. Multiple speakers are a workaround for a problem, not an inherent advantage.
The point of a coaxial speaker is to keep the sound coherent. What would be ideal is to have a bass/mid cone that crossed over to the tweeter, 4 kHz, then you would avoid a crossover in the speech discrimination band. However no such animal exists at present and crossover to the tweeter in current units is in the neighborhood of 3 kHz.
In a coaxial, the cone of the woofer acts as a wave guide to the tweeter. Things a re designed such that there is usually time coherence. However because a first order crossover is just about never possible, there are phase anomalies at crossover, just like any other speaker. There is symmetrical lobing and therefore the vertical and horizontal axis response is identical. The coverage is therefore conical.
As far as drivers to choose from the most well known are KEF and Tannoy. Thiel also has a coaxial center. Pioneer also have one in their range.
However, after having auditioned KEF recently the SEAS driver is in my view far superior.
You can buy a LOKI kit [madisound.com] that is very good value.
I use these drivers in my center speaker. The tweeter is used only in the lower driver, the upper one is an active fill driver and the tweeter not connected.
In this TL, I could not be more happy with it.
lsiberian;637476
For If you are interested in a coaxial accessories4less sells KEF speakers for a pretty cheap clip. Still you'd have to like their other offering. I think the best horizontal center I've heard in the budget range is the Beta 360 treated with rockwool and peel-n-seal
Thanks for the recommendations. The Beta 360 would be too large for my application although it does look nice. The KEF Q series, iQ60c, looks like it might work pretty well as it's less than 7" tall. The speaker cabinet design is a bit different but that isn't a breaking point. How do co-axials differ from in sound or performance from a more "traditional" design where the speakers are seperate?
irish;637446
Thanks for your response! I was pretty sure that was the case but I may have no choice due to my set up. It's a living room/HT set up and acoustically won't be great but it's what we have. I'm still learning and have no idea what the bolded words mean. If I understand correctly when a center is horizontal the tweeter needs to be raised vertically so that it's not in line with the mids...
The stand I have is like this one http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=15604297&postcount=105 [avsforum.com] so there isn't room a for a center due to the units being pushed together. I'm also size limited due to using a plasma on it's stand with a 7" clearance from base to screen so bookshelf speakers won't fit.
The best fit from quality mfgs that I've found would be the Def Techs or Paradigm CC-190 which does have vertically aligned tweeters http://paradigm.com/en/paradigm/speaker_only-specification-6-1-3-4.paradigm [paradigm.com]. Would that be a better option that the Mythos?
Thanks a bunch for helping me out!
These might work too but they're aligned as well http://paradigm.com/en/reference/speaker_only-specification-65-1-3-20.paradigm [paradigm.com]
For If you are interested in a coaxial accessories4less sells KEF speakers for a pretty cheap clip. Still you'd have to like their other offering. I think the best horizontal center I've heard in the budget range is the Beta 360 treated with rockwool and peel-n-seal
irish;637446
Thanks for your response! I was pretty sure that was the case but I may have no choice due to my set up. It's a living room/HT set up and acoustically won't be great but it's what we have. I'm still learning and have no idea what the bolded words mean. If I understand correctly when a center is horizontal the tweeter needs to be raised vertically so that it's not in line with the mids...
The stand I have is like this one http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=15604297&postcount=105 [avsforum.com] so there isn't room a for a center due to the units being pushed together. I'm also size limited due to using a plasma on it's stand with a 7" clearance from base to screen so bookshelf speakers won't fit.
The best fit from quality mfgs that I've found would be the Def Techs or Paradigm CC-190 which does have vertically aligned tweeters http://paradigm.com/en/paradigm/speaker_only-specification-6-1-3-4.paradigm [paradigm.com]. Would that be a better option that the Mythos?
Thanks a bunch for helping me out!
These might work too but they're aligned as well http://paradigm.com/en/reference/speaker_only-specification-65-1-3-20.paradigm [paradigm.com]
The paradigm C190 is on the right lines, but I think you would have to go with an all Paradigm system, as they have a definite voicing about them, that I did not care for when I auditioned them, at least the Studio 100s
Thanks for your response! I was pretty sure that was the case but I may have no choice due to my set up. It's a living room/HT set up and acoustically won't be great but it's what we have. I'm still learning and have no idea what the bolded words mean. If I understand correctly when a center is horizontal the tweeter needs to be raised vertically so that it's not in line with the mids...
The stand I have is like this one http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showpost.php?p=15604297&postcount=105 [avsforum.com] so there isn't room a for a center due to the units being pushed together. I'm also size limited due to using a plasma on it's stand with a 7" clearance from base to screen so bookshelf speakers won't fit.
The best fit from quality mfgs that I've found would be the Def Techs or Paradigm CC-190 which does have vertically aligned tweeters http://paradigm.com/en/paradigm/speaker_only-specification-6-1-3-4.paradigm [paradigm.com]. Would that be a better option that the Mythos?
Thanks a bunch for helping me out!
These might work too but they're aligned as well http://paradigm.com/en/reference/speaker_only-specification-65-1-3-20.paradigm [paradigm.com]



